East Flows for the Bay during CS9??

[Rob Law]

All norcal controllers,

I'm not sure if you have looked at the weather forcast for the bay area for sunday, but they are predicting rain and southerly winds possibly greater than 10kts.

That means that the bay may be in an EAST FLOW situation :D. Dust off that east flow documentation fellas just in case

Rob L

[Sachin]

Thanks for the heads up Rob.. It sounds like even more fun for APC_APP :D

[bradl]

Originally posted by Sachin@Nov 6 2003, 04:57 PM
Thanks for the heads up Rob.. It sounds like even more fun for APC_APP :D
Time for those cheat sheats! :) I remember CS2, when LAX was in east ops, and we REALLY had to do some changing around there, because no-one really expects it.

Mike Evans and Dave Hendleman from ZLA took a trip to SCT one day, when LAX was, by coincidence, in east ops, and the controllers there had their cheat sheets out, because they themselves aren't used to east ops. They handle it well, but it's a rarity when it happens.

All the more reason to, sometime soon, set up a trip to NCT. Any takers? :)

BL.

[Rob Law]

DEFINATELY COUNT ME IN.

When did they start allowing tours again??

Rob

[bradl]

Originally posted by roblaw94588@Nov 6 2003, 09:55 PM
DEFINATELY COUNT ME IN.

When did they start allowing tours again??

Rob
I'll check up on that. I've been in the MHR area for a bit now (new job has me split between Sacramento and Las Vegas), and I know this has been in the works with ZOA for a while. If there's a definite interest, I'll get some dialog open with NCT and see what we can see.

BL.

[feathers]

Sweeet! You know, the last time I was working KSFO (actually, I think that was the flyout) the winds were 210@?? (I forget the speed, maybe 8 knots) which is getting pretty close to east ops. Of course, I realize this after the fact...

So, with the threat of it for CS9, I have a question: How would one go about switching plans on the fly? Or is such a thing done? If the bay is on Normal Ops and the winds swing around to a fairly steady 210@12, what happens? Does KSFO Tower make the call and start the changeover?

On the subject of NCT (or even SCT) tours, dude I'd totally be down for that. Granted, I'd be a lot more likely to make a tour to SoCal (it's just a _tiny_ bit closer). I have two sisters who are in my AERO classes this semester and their father works for SoCal Approach. Last I heard from them, outside tours are a very rare thing, but maybe something can be arranged.

Of course you realize, next year we'll have to call it CSX... could that be California Screamin' Xtreme? ^_^

James

[bradl]

Originally posted by feathers@Nov 7 2003, 01:32 AM
Sweeet! You know, the last time I was working KSFO (actually, I think that was the flyout) the winds were 210@?? (I forget the speed, maybe 8 knots) which is getting pretty close to east ops. Of course, I realize this after the fact...

So, with the threat of it for CS9, I have a question: How would one go about switching plans on the fly? Or is such a thing done? If the bay is on Normal Ops and the winds swing around to a fairly steady 210@12, what happens? Does KSFO Tower make the call and start the changeover?

On the subject of NCT (or even SCT) tours, dude I'd totally be down for that. Granted, I'd be a lot more likely to make a tour to SoCal (it's just a _tiny_ bit closer). I have two sisters who are in my AERO classes this semester and their father works for SoCal Approach. Last I heard from them, outside tours are a very rare thing, but maybe something can be arranged.

Of course you realize, next year we'll have to call it CSX... could that be California Screamin' Xtreme? ^_^

James
Actually, it's fairly quite easy to change them on the fly.. Mid-air, even! Compare the BSR2 to the HADLY2. Same route up through BSR, then the split after that to over the ocean and around for HADLY, instead of through SKUNK and BOLDR. Same goes for the LOCKE1/MOD2. same arrival until MOD, then they split. It's the same way in SOCAL with the CIVET4 arrival, and the BASET2. Same waypoints all the way down, but instead of staying on the LOC, before the 25L OM, they take a turn south over Palos Verdes, out over the ocean, then come back in. The only real difference is the altitudes. SFO won't be much of a problem, as long as you keep the arrivals higher than the departures. If you notice at LAX, when departures come off of 7R, the arrivals are still basically head on on the 25L LOC until they turn south, but high enough that the departures can turn off and go where they need per the departure. It's the altitude and routing that the real world SCT and NCT aren't used to because of the rarity of East Ops, hence the cheat sheets.

As for tours, here's what NCT has to say, at least according to the Message frame from http://www2.faa.gov/ats/nct/ :

"Please call in advance if you are interested in visiting our facility. Although our building construction and most installation is complete, the changing security environment may limit our ability to fully display all aspects of the new facility. Please watch this site for upcoming changes. We can be reached at 916-366-4001 or by email if you have any questions. Please let your friends know about our web site, especially if they plan to fly in and around the Northern California area. You will hear us use the call-sign of "NORCAL Approach".

To me, unless I need to retake English classes again, means that if given ample notice, a visit would be welcome. There is also an FAA-sponsored project called "Operation Raincheck", which grants those who are interested (and want to see tax dollars at work) visits to ATC facilities. But once again, that is with ample notice. I'll check to see if it is possible with them, and keep you informed.

BL.